Merchants

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Chestie
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Merchants

Post by Chestie » Sun Jun 17, 2018 10:35 pm

Would like to see vendors selling ingots in either stacks of 250 or 500 (preferably 500).

There's no joy or fun in running around for 6-10 hours accumulating ingots ahead of time so they can be used for stat totems. Already takes a fairly long and arduous amount of time to acquire the favors, money to purchase ingots and actually level smithing as it is.

Without having training ingots available we're going to burn through obscene amounts of ingots at higher levels. Having to continually do ingot runs through all the towns will still be necessary, just not so much for the newer smith players.

iresh
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Re: Merchants

Post by iresh » Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:50 am

at one point in time i did have skiller ingot sold from the merchant player voted them out because they thought it was cheating. but maybe bathroy would allow gold dusts to drop normally they have a 4x wv of normal dusts.

Chestie
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Re: Merchants

Post by Chestie » Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:31 am

Having gold dust drop naturally would be cool, but that's not a way to fix a problem with leveling higher end smithing.

The skiller ingots shouldn't exist, I don't think it's a good idea either. But increasing the amount of ingots sold on the merchants is something that would dramatically improve Quality of Life for every player.

It's basically the same solution - sucks gold out of the game and lets players skill smithing by having access to more ingots. The only difference is they're no longer fail smithing, they're successfully making weapons. It means they have to expertise or dismantle as a requirement while leveling SS.

Strongly loathe the limited merchant sales on ingots and having to run merchants for two or three FULL DAYS to get enough ingots to skill with before making a stat totem. It's miserable.

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Yuritau
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Re: Merchants

Post by Yuritau » Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:37 am

I'm in agreement with Chestie here. There's enough different elements of grind in the game already. There's no need to continue enforcing a huge time suck like this.

Haddassah
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Re: Merchants

Post by Haddassah » Mon Jun 18, 2018 5:16 am

I'm with Chestie and Yuritau on this one. Smithing is such a bore and a chore as it is, it's the only skill and part of the game I don't do...and adding more ingots won't change that so if it helps the few dedicated smith's, I think it'll help the game.

Vayle
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Re: Merchants

Post by Vayle » Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:59 pm

Agreed

took2summit
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Re: Merchants

Post by took2summit » Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:19 pm

100% agreed. In addition I'd like plain beads moved to 500. As chestie said this wont eliminate the need to run beads/ingots. It takes about an hour to run 15k. A high level smith/geo can burn through 150k in no time...10 hours of running. If changed to 500 you would still be spending 2 hours running beads/ingots every 150k. Let's spend less time mindlessly running from town to town and more time playing the game we all enjoy.

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Bathory
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Re: Merchants

Post by Bathory » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:53 pm

So you guys are saying that you want to weaken the path to max out smiths and geomancers?
These skills are very powerful and there is a reason that levelling at higher end is tough.
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took2summit
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Re: Merchants

Post by took2summit » Tue Jun 19, 2018 7:22 pm

Bath I really dont think theres going to be any more counselor Smiths or geomancers running around by selling beads and ingots by 500 instead of 100..what's more, if 100% of the player base agrees that spending 30+ hours running from town to town is an aspect that once was part of the game but should be looked at, should we not look at it?

Like I said before I think taking a 30 hour ingot or bead run and bringing it down to 6 hours by making the ingot and beat count 500 will not change the make up of the server at all..the main hurdle is still gold.

CNCCocoa
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Re: Merchants

Post by CNCCocoa » Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:39 pm

[moved to another thread]
Last edited by CNCCocoa on Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Yuritau
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Re: Merchants

Post by Yuritau » Wed Jun 20, 2018 1:35 am

Increasing the merchant amounts does nothing to "weaken the path" of getting high smithing/geo levels.

You still have farm up the gold to buy the ingots/beads. NO CHANGE

You still have to farm up or but the meats (for geo). NO CHANGE

You still have spend the time (sooo many hours) mindlessly mouse-clicking the skill (and transferring beads/meat for geo). NO CHANGE

The only thing that changes is a slightly reduced waste of time spent running from merchant to merchant. That's all. Hell, it'll still probably take long enough that the smiths and mages will still offer to pay for ingot or bead runs.

Chestie
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Re: Merchants

Post by Chestie » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:17 am

@Cocoa - Create a new thread if you want to suggest something off topic please

@Bath
- Yuri hit the nail on the head. This has nothing to do with weakening the path to max out smiths or geomancers. The problem isn't even maxing them or leveling at the higher end because that requires Viz/Elat farming. This is a problem before you even get to higher end smith/geo...

At no point should a player be required to run 30+ hours of ingot farm off merchants just to be able to adequately skill something. Additionally, if I'm running ingots for 30 hours that means nobody else on the server gets access to ingots during that time.

It's a bottleneck right from the beginning of smithing and geomancy that is a horrible design flaw. You need immense amounts of gold farming just to purchase the ingots in the first place. Once players get high enough to acquire vast amounts of dust, they're going to bypass the ingot farming and put 10k reds in the workbench instead.

All this limitation does is stifle early/mid-game for players who are already struggling. Even as the highest dlvl player on the server I can't adequately afford to fund the ingots I need to advance further. So not only am I struggling financially, I have to spend 30+ hours buying crap off merchants at the same time. This detracts from gameplay and dramatically increases burnout rate when it really doesn't need to.

CNCCocoa
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Re: Merchants

Post by CNCCocoa » Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:38 am

Chestie wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 3:17 am
@Cocoa - Create a new thread if you want to suggest something off topic please
I think you missed my point.

Edit: Also, I never had issues with buying enough ingots, even though I started playing after you started doing your ingot runs, so don't pretend like you're doing this for new players.

Which, after all, was part of my point.

Chestie
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Re: Merchants

Post by Chestie » Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:01 am

@Cocoa - I didn't miss your point. This thread has nothing to do with reducing the difficulty of anyone's chosen path, it's about improving the quality of life for players by adjusting merchant values. Your post has zero relevance; please post off topic suggestions elsewhere.

Nowhere in anyone's argument do they conclude this has anything to do with new players either, as they don't have the gold required to purchase ingots in volume anyways. You're also not at a point where considerable amounts of ingots are required to level as you're new and just beginning your journey on this server.

CNCCocoa
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Re: Merchants

Post by CNCCocoa » Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:29 am

Chestie wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:01 am
Nowhere in anyone's argument do they conclude this has anything to do with new players either
This is a problem before you even get to higher end smith/geo
Additionally, if I'm running ingots for 30 hours that means nobody else on the server gets access to ingots during that time.
It's a bottleneck right from the beginning of smithing and geomancy
All this limitation does is stifle early/mid-game for players who are already struggling.
is something that would dramatically improve Quality of Life for every player.
Having to continually do ingot runs through all the towns will still be necessary, just not so much for the newer smith players.
Edit:
Chestie wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:01 am
You're also not at a point where considerable amounts of ingots are required to level as you're new and just beginning your journey on this server.
Literally dismantling swords as I type this.

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Bathory
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Re: Merchants

Post by Bathory » Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:11 pm

I can think of doubling the ingots at the merchant, plain beads will stay as is.
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zaphod77
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Re: Merchants

Post by zaphod77 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:26 am

Instead of doubling all around, we could make it so the ones that take longer to replenish have more of them.

this way, zandalls merchants (who are level six with the best totems money can buy) would have more ingots then Fingles (level one with crappy totems). This would help both people doing a teleport and yoink everyone run) because they would get more ingots in the loop and people who stay at a far away town (all other towns other than floan will have more ingots available). It would also make people camp fingle less if they could camp a different town and still have money.

Another idea would be to have a new fourth type of guild spec. Commerce.

the first spec level would spawn a guild merchant.

It would carry a certain supply of ingots, plain beads, charcoal bricks, twisted papers, and cotton ropes.

If you raised the spec to 2, it would have twice as much stuff. at 3 3 times as much stuff.

or maybe the factors would be different. But it would allow people to spend massive amount of money to be able to craft easier. :) and it would free the existing merchants for the guildless people.

it would also increase the benefits of being in a guild, which is probably a good thing?

Chestie
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Re: Merchants

Post by Chestie » Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:30 pm

Commerce spec is an interesting thought... Kinda like it.

Increasing the rate of respawn doesn't solve the issue at hand unless it becomes near instantaneous, though increasing specific merchant stock would help. I think the issue is that merchant stock is held as a single file that effects all merchants and adjusting specific towns would require considerable adjustment to how merchants operate.

Trying to adjust things with the least amount of work possible for Iresh. Doubling the ingot amount is less than we were all probably hoping for... but I'll take it nonetheless.

iresh
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Re: Merchants

Post by iresh » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:16 pm

bathroy will except doubling the ingots so says the god. i will obey that choice. if you all agree to that.

CNCCocoa
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Re: Merchants

Post by CNCCocoa » Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:40 pm

iresh wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:16 pm
if you all agree to that.
Does that mean that I can veto it? :twisted:

Chestie
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Re: Merchants

Post by Chestie » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:04 am

/agree

zaphod77
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Re: Merchants

Post by zaphod77 » Fri Jun 22, 2018 5:53 am

Everything in the items file must have the same stock. but the only thing anyone cares about are the ingots. the worthless rocks are well, worthless, and the imperial weapons are impossible to benefit from in any significant way.

Each town has both a number of merchants, and a level for their merchants. higher level merchants take longer to replenish. this is not going to be changed, even though people rarely buy totems higher then iron.

but you would think a better merchant would have bigger stock.

Kar
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Re: Merchants

Post by Kar » Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:02 pm

This is why I delete delete delete. It was merely an idea or two, no droning on, whining, or complaining intended.
Last edited by Kar on Fri Sep 28, 2018 6:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

iresh
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Re: Merchants

Post by iresh » Sun Sep 23, 2018 8:34 pm

salt meats have always been like that . if you do not stash or sell the meats it will keep charging you. it became salt all because the old days players would yank your meats before you salt them or trade for them back you still can sell your meats by clicking each stack and selling to the merchant. sell all meats also took the salted meats as well. it might be possible to have salt all only do the ones that arn't already salted.

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